What is active participation

Active participation = always present? [Page 3]

Anonymous  📅 29.09.2015 18:29:57
Re: Active participation = always present?
If the professors all kneeled in too ...
Get a lot more salary than student loans.
Groa  📅 29.09.2015 19:42:32
Re: Active participation = always present?
I laugh myself limp. In fact, that's what I've said to my employer so far: I have to take care of my children. That's the way it is, the employer cannot do anything with sick children, one of the parents stays at home, there are no warnings or the like.

I cannot understand the mentioned "responsibility" either. I am only responsible for myself and my family and, of course, for team tasks also for the group result (I absolutely accept that). Otherwise, compulsory attendance doesn't make sense for me.

But when I am there, "active participation" is absolutely given for me, so there is no showering ....
sef  📅 29.09.2015 20:53:00
Re: Active participation = always present?
On the other hand, what do you want to say to an employer later? "I'm going now because I have to see my children and besides, I'm over 30 and I won't let you tell me anything. Do your own thing." "Ok, no problem, here is the warning / termination."

I don't even appreciate something like that at university. If someone gets sick or something bad happens, okay, although I know students whose parents have died several times with various colleagues ...
but to argue in the normal course with child + private life ...
sorry, I can't do that either, BECAUSE we are all adults, you should understand that everyone involved in the job (and I see university more as a job than a school) is not responsible for personal sensitivities.
And that with money is - as has often been mentioned - relative. Depending on the contract, a lecturer earns between 0.- (unpaid teaching position) and 400.- (HWK) per month, employees + civil servants more, but there are fewer and fewer. Many have a second job in addition to university.
Ersti09 *  📅 30.09.2015 08:45:25
Re: Active participation = always present?
Uni is not an employer where I exchange my workforce for money. I am not obliged to put my work in the service of the university, but primarily work for myself.
Otherwise pay me for my presence. Then I like to be there and read a good novel in the back row.
Still, nobody can force me to use my brain.


Of course, everyone should do what for their studies. In order to guarantee this, there are certain limits in relation to student loans for performance notices and module examinations for every student.
So what a compulsory attendance for, except that you wave your palm on it in front of the computer?
You are also of the opinion that your colleague in the home office does not work at all. He's just sitting around.
Do you think that an hour's drive and 90 minutes of sleep in the lecture hall is more effective than letting the student choose how he learns better, how he uses his time?

Studies are not a measurable obligation in terms of time. Some students take longer, some only briefly, to process the content. The point is that this is exactly what has to happen - but the HOW does not really matter (if you disregard certain events).


@sef
Responsibility as a lecturer - yes, for good teachingoffer and fair grading.
Why do you want to burden yourself with a responsibility that the student does not even want to admit to you?
First and foremost, a student is just like you an adult, whom you should treat on an equal footing, and like a child who has been handed over to you and who has to take care of them when you go to school.
It goes without saying that you warn of problems if you are not present. That was it already.

One question: How can a student who only comes to you for an exam do more work than a student who always sat in the lecture?
In case of doubt, the former messes up his exam and causes trouble afterwards. But that is a question of character and being forced to be present does not change anything.
Participation desired  📅 30.09.2015 09:53:08
Re: Active participation = always present?
A different learning situation is usually associated with a seminar.
Lectures are often given and there should also be an exchange with and among the students.

Some now think that it is enough to give your own presentation and then you don't need to appear again (because you don't feel like it, you don't get paid for it, etc.), then
my hair stands on end.

Then where is the respect for the lecturer, the respect for the fellow students, the respect for the offer to be able to study? For some, it seems that only satisfying their own needs counts.

Nobody can tell me that even the majority of those who refuse to attend regularly catch up on the material at home. I am convinced that it is only important to them to get a degree as stress-free as possible and with minimal effort.
There may be exceptions ...
Timmy the 1994.  📅 30.09.2015 10:21:11
Re: Active participation = always present?
"Active participation" is a rather vague term and is implemented more or less strictly / extremely.

I once had a seminar where around 50 people were regularly present, and only 5 people actually took part on a regular basis. The active participation was however certified to everyone, whereby the "lazy" people are rewarded and the hardworking people are "punished".
However, this is a basic problem of universities, since, unlike in schools, there are no oral grades here and everyone is waved through outside of exams (which are usually a little stricter).

It may be that affected people really want to cheat their way through the course with as little effort as possible. Another assumption on my part would be that you have about 7 events in the semester and it is not possible to sacrifice yourself for each individual event, but rather set priorities, also because you don't only live for the university, but also things outside of the university Need attention.
Ersti09 *  📅 30.09.2015 10:51:09
Re: Active participation = always present?
Desired by participation A different learning situation is usually associated with a seminar.
Lectures are often given and there should also be an exchange with and among the students.

Some now think that it is enough to give your own presentation and then you don't have to appear again (because you don't feel like it, you don't get paid for it, etc.), then
my hair stands on end.

Then where is the respect for the lecturer, the respect for the fellow students, the respect for the offer of being able to study? For some, it seems that only satisfying their own needs counts.

Nobody can tell me that even the majority of those who refuse to attend regularly catch up on the material at home. I am convinced that the only thing that matters to them is to get a degree as stress-free as possible and with minimal effort.
There may be exceptions ...
Seminars are not even up for discussion. The need to be present arises automatically, otherwise the learning objective cannot be achieved.

I show respect for lecturers by showing good performance in exams and seminars. Not by sleeping in the back row, as is customary with the presence fetishists. They don't concentrate 100% all the time and presence is then the alibi. Something was done.
In truth, you let yourself be sprinkled, had a coffee during the breaks and the next day 80% was forgotten.

It's not about the fact that I wanted to be paid (the section is garnished with a smiley on bold, you could have guessed that it wasn't meant seriously).
But you cannot construct any equation between job and study place and ignore important aspects in the process.
E.g. that I don't primarily work for the lecturer, but for myself. And that is why certain freedoms (including the freedom not to give your best for certain subjects and to invest little time in favor of other lectures, for example) belong to it.

I think this is very important, because I have the freedom to adjust my work and time according to my study interests and not according to the lecturer's nose and attendance times.
That is the problem: coercion, obligations, etc. do not exactly open the minds of students to voluntary learning.
If you only instill schedules and bench seats into people, you will only get people who work that way.

He doesn't get those who skip a boring lecture to get involved with refugees.
Or read a paper.
Or to complete the housework again.

As I said, just because someone is physically present does not mean that they are also mentally present. Requiring attendance in general is therefore pointless. Then the party student torments himself out of bed at 7 a.m. into which he fell at 4 a.m. and listens to higher mathematics. Can't tell me that's your idea
present-or-not  📅 30.09.2015 10:52:06
Re: Active participation = always present?
I called and asked. The lady said it wasn't like school and there were no participation lists.
Thank you for making your head anyway.
sef  📅 30.09.2015 19:04:47
Re: Active participation = always present?
@ersti

that's rubbish. Of course you don't get any money, but something else. Don't you know the different types of capital?
In addition, you are based on the assumption that a lecturer only teaches knowledge and that he doesn't care about his students ...
That's not the case. Of course, you think about whether and how someone will pass the course and when you notice that someone is digging their own grave because he has all the offers - for example, that there is an expert who will provide you with the material for the exam / future working world mediates - then that doesn't leave you indifferent.
I really don't know anyone across all FBs, you always sit together a lot and think about how you could improve something, sometimes almost too much.
The university's internal advanced training department also offers something to reach the last students, be it advanced training on blended learning, pingo, diversity .....

It's not as tough as you portray it (or would like it to be?).
sef  📅 30.09.2015 19:08:17
Re: Active participation = always present?

Why do you want to burden yourself with a responsibility that the student does not even want to admit to you?


Funny. Mine see me as part of their academic success - and not just as an examiner and corrector or a walking pdf.